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Into the Warren…

31 Mar

I’m posting two trees, here, as follow-up to my last post (about the recently discovered body of Richard III, last Plantagenet king of England and the search for his male-line, or Y-chromosome DNA).

One is the line as I’ve researched it from Geoffrey Plantagenet through the well-known Warrens of Poynton to the Warrens of Ripple and Dover, Kent then to the immigrant ancestor of my family friends, Thomas Warren, Sr., who settled in Surry County, Virginia in the 1640s. Click on it to see it much larger and in detail.

The second tree (below the lengthy one) is the chart showing these same friends’ relatives, focusing on their male cousins, who I hope to contact and encourage to get their DNA tested to compare to the Warrens at large AND to the Plantagenet Y-DNA, once it’s announced to the world.

WARREN DBL CHK 2

geoffrey1113 - 1151

geoffrey
1113 – 1151

 

Up here at the tippy top is good ole Geoffrey the Fifth, Count of Anjou, father to King Henry II of England and to Hamelin, Count of Anjou, whose son inherited the title “Earl of Warenne” from the woman he married….

 

 

Isabel de Warenne1137 - 1203

Isabel de Warenne
1137 – 1203

 

…the extremely wealthy and land-rich Isabel de Warenne. —->

 

Among genealogical and history of royalty circles online, there’s a bit of an argument over which American Warrens are descended from the Plantagenet Warrens. Aside from simply verifying or refuting lines of descent for people, knowing the answer will help sort out some tangled threads of information regarding the early colonial settlement of America, as well as the manner in which members of the ever-less-landed gentry dealt with their decreasing holdings in the 15th & 16th centuries. And this answer will come in the form of what ever Y-DNA haplogroup Richard III (and by extension, the Plantagenets) turns out to be, and how that matches up or doesn’t with various pods of contemporary Warrens.

So in terms of my friends, well I’m also descended from Geoffrey Plantagenet. Several dozen times over. But I’m not descended from him in the male line, so my Y-DNA is irrelevant to this. Thus the big big question — and I invite other researchers to please chime in on this — is the the veracity of the connection between the Warrens of Poynton, specifically Sir Lawrence Warren (see the two boxes to the left that are oulined in red) who lived and died in Poynton, England, and is known to be a descendant of the Warren men who were the Earls of Surrey, and the William Warren who died in Dover in about 1506. Sir Lawrence is england-mapsknown to have had a son named William. But was it the same William who shows up in Dover, progenitor of a line of Warren men that were mayors there for a few generations in a row? It’s been noted that their sort of arriving on the scene and getting to be mayor (as well as chief of customs) certainly has the ring of people who have big deal connections (such as any kids of Sir Lawrence or other Warrens of Poynton would have).

A smaller question that also requires verification is the connection later between John and William Warren, (William who appears to have been the father of the immigrant Thomas: see orange-oulined boxes in the long chart to the left).

 

Aaaaand, finally, here are the uncles and cousins…

WARRENS 2DAY 2

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Posted by on March 31, 2013 in Uncategorized

 

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